Did you choose that picture just because Rob looks so awful in it? I love, love, love that Rose City won, but that picture is hilarious

Great question about “When is it going to be for the fans?”

And at first I was disappointed by Grace’s Profit answer, but then she addressed the better subtleties of it. The leagues need to be cognizant of what the paying ticket holders are looking for in a product. This is even more important for the leagues that are interested in traveling all over the country/world in order to play the top level of derby.

I just hope that the short-distance teams’ goals, which can function on a smaller income, don’t negatively impact the long-distance teams’ goals, which require a greater income.

Fortunately, there’s probably a positive correlation between who pushes the boundaries of the rules in an attempt to win and those that are traveling long distances. Thus, as long as the leagues keep in mind what the customers want, they should hopefully affect the rules accordingly.

@Megatron
agreed! totally love the emotion expressed in this shot.

This was a fucking fantastic episode. You talked to exactly the right person you needed to talk to at exactly the right time, and you’re starting to ask the questions that need to be asked to figure this out. This is why I love Derby Deeds.

But let me put on my superfan hat for a second. When Dumptruck asked about the situation of the refs “not calling” out of play penalties to blockers at the rear of a split-pack/no-pack situation, what he and the leagues that talked to him about it (and apparently, everyone else) doesn’t realize is that ***there is no penalty to call.***

Think about it. Once there’s 11 feet of space between two teams, a no-pack situation is called. Per the (current) rules, both teams are responsible for maintaining the pack, so they’ll get penalties if they don’t attempt to reform it immediately.

The team at the front can only slow down, stop, or stay stopped in order to reform the pack. The jammer they are attempting to block can continue to skate forward untouched, easily getting lead jammer or scoring points.

The team at the rear can only SPEED UP in order to reform the pack. The jammer they are attempting to block can continue to skate forward untouched….right into the blockers that have skated forward into the boundary of the pack, allowing them to continue blocking the jammer.

Once the no-pack is called, all the team at the rear needs to do is stop blocking the jammer, skate forward again with the jammer (while not blocking her) to reform the pack, and then continue blocking the jammer. While that happens, the team at the front has to stop blocking the jammer, slow down, watch her skate on by, and watch helplessly as there’s nothing they can do to break up the 4-wall, 10 feet behind them.

So you want to know why Rat City refused to move off the rear line, even when they were down a boatload of points? They wanted Rocky Mountain to move off the line first, so they force Rocky’s front 4-wall to disappear once they got 10 feet ahead of Rat’s 4-wall at the back. That would almost guarantee Rat City lead jammer—and points, should everything else be equal.

And you wonder why Rocky Mountain refused to move forward off the front line? Because they are a smart roller derby team. They knew the inherent disadvantages that being at the front of the pack were. They knew that with the lead, they could burn off all the clock in the world.

Rat didn’t want to move forward because they didn’t want to give up an advantageous place (the back of the pack). Rocky didn’t want to move forward, because they didn’t want to put themselves into a disadvantageous place (the front of the pack).

Therefore, when both teams realize that the most advantageous place to be is at the back, and neither team will budge until the other team goes forward to give it to them, what do you get?

No roller derby.

That seems like an awful problem, doesn’t it?

N8 :

All sports are really for the fans, in the long run. If a person playing a sport, isn’t a fan of the sport they are playing…then why are they a fan? Why are they playing the sport?

“For the skater, by the skater” is really not any different than saying “for the fans, by the fans,” in my opinion. It’s just that some fans put countless hours into training to play the game (that they are a fan of) for whatever reason, and some pay money to see the game be played for whatever reason—usually to be entertained. Either way, a contribution is made to better the sport.

The second you ignore the fans’ interest in the game, you’re doing a disservice to the players who love the game, and play the game for the right reasons.

I’m actually surprised that Grace Killy, of all people, would fail to recognize that the Green Bay Packers are owned ***by the fans*** of the team. Even if the players that play the game are professional, they wouldn’t play football if they weren’t football fans.

Even in a professional environment, as long as the right people are doing the right things for the right reasons, everything can still work and be fair for everyone.

However, if you have a set of rules that aren’t equally fair to both teams at all times, or a set of rules that are fair to the fans (and skaters) who want to have a good time watching the sport of roller derby, how can anything ever work?

Hey thanks for the love and having super awesome fun time with me last weekend. Seriously I had a blast! Anywho, I hate this new strategy derby is taking on…..and when I say hate I mean it makes me want to stop skating lol…….just kidding, but seriously it sucks to skate in and it sucks to watch. Boycott stop derby whatever it’s called! Love all you hoes xoxo

http://www.facebook.com/iheartderby?sk=questions

xoxo

G-Hoe

err, that last bit of my last comment wasn’t N8 or directed at N8. Just some HTML fail on my part.

@Megatron

Great picture choice. I think Scald Eagle, Marilyn Gun-Hoe, and Amanda Jamitinya were the most fun to watch at Besterns.

Windy Man, you are spot on. Both teams were using the rules to their advantage…except that means no derby. and no no derby obviously makes a LOT of people mad.

i’m glad this continues to happen, it shows there is something we need to discuss as the wftda and as skaters who relies on our fans to pay for tickets and support our sport.

nice recaps! miss the crew, but DAYUM you kids are workin it!

@WindyMan

About your analysis, I don’t disagree with it at all, but I thought Dumptruck was referring to a different problem. This is the fact that positional blocking counts as blocking as per the rules, and thus positional blocking from a standstill is against the rules. Furthermore, positional blocking while outside of the engagement zone is also against the rules. Lastly, actual physical blocking while outside the engagement zone is against the rules.

In my experience, and the experience of several skaters (I know this exact issue was brought up in the players-officials meeting before Eastern Regionals), when any of the above happens in the back of the pack, it is almost never called, and it is definitely not called at the same rate that it is called out in front of the pack.

@N8

Ah, I got you. I didn’t understand the difference there. Thanks for clearing that up.

Still, even if a penalty is called at the back, whether it’s pack destruction, blocking out of play, or whatever, once the jammer at the front gets a free pass and becomes lead jammer or gets free points via the no pack, a big advantage that cannot be taken away by the other team.

This is basically setting a precedent that it’s okay to commit a penalty to get an advantage for their team. Did you split the pack (intentionally or “accidentally”) and get an out of play penalty? Doesn’t matter, your jammer up front got lead jammer. Doesn’t matter, your team just scored 5 points on that power jam pass. And there’s not a damn thing the other team can fairly do about it.

Not to beat my chest, but I saw this coming as far back as six months ago. That a team can commit as many as 84 penalties before one of their players gets ejected leaves way too many free outs from their consequences, especially when in certain situations, getting a penalty can be a GOOD thing for your team, or they are totally inconsequential (such as being down a few blockers while on a power jam).

As long as the no-pack situation exists, I don’t believe there is any kind of counter-strategy or rule band-aid that will prevent these inherent disadvantages from existing. Because it’s unfair.

No pack equals no derby.

THATS OUR KOOZIES!!! WAY TO BE MILES!!! REPPIN HARD FOR DENVER!!!

My favorite episode yet! Good job

Ahahaha!

Dump Truck, you are such a wordsmith!

“The glass can go from half empty to half full… but right now I’m thirsty as hell!”

Why did nobody crack up over that?? That was verbal acrobatics and I give it a 10.

No, you know what?? This one goes to 11. A score of 11 for Dump Truck.

Aurora Gidget loves Derby deeds!!! Thank you guys for the shout out!!!! Big Big LOVE Keep up the amazing podcasts!

XOXO

Razorslut and Aurora!